PETE WARD

"WELCOME TO MY OUTDOOR WORLD"

Gear Review

Montana Bows  

By

Dan Toelke

31345 Lost Creek Lane.

Ronan, Mt 59864

(406) 676-5150

E mail Dan Toelke, Bowyer

www.montanabows.com

"Whip longbows"

Bow#1, 58" 51# @ 27"

Limb cores are  
2, heat treated bamboo
1, imbuia
1, red elm
2, black limbia (faces)
2, gordon glass
the riser is Shedua
grip overlays are shedua & imbuia
tips are black glass & Shedua/imbuia
strings are made of  Dynema 02 (BCY)
recomended brace is 6 7/8-7 3/8

Bow #2 ,62" 45# @ 28"

Limbs:   Goncalo Alves   faces 

Gordons clear glass,

Bamboo core 

2 maple laminations

Riser: Grandillo with Purple heart overlays.

Update March 2007

I just received this note from dan, he has improved his already great finish and has started making the whip available with the popular Bow Bolt for the 2 piece longbow lovers.

"Pete just a quick note, I have changed my bow finish same look but a mutch more durable matte. I am also offering the whip with the bow bolt now in a 2 piece t/d the bolt has worked out nice. Dan"
 
 
Also here is a letter I received from Allen Chatten, a friend that ordered a Whip after shooting my 45# 62"review bow. I shot Allen's new whip last night and have to say that it is every bit as good as the bows I have for the review in all respects.
 
Pete,

Thank you for lending me the 45# Montana Whip this winter. After using
it a few times this summer I loved the feel of it. After using it this
winter (since you would not sell it) I had to order one of my own. As an
archer with 15 years experience but a relative newbie to the traditional
world a few things stood out with the montana Whip bow that I enjoyed
enough to get one of my own. It is smooth to draw, no hand shock on
release and the performance is very good and silent. The feel of the
grip and overall feel of the bow is awesome. I look forward to many
years with my own Montana Whip bow.

Thank You

Allen Chatten,
 
Here is a  note from John Biscup another "Whip" tester.
 

  I've been shooting compound bows for quite a few years now and attribute archery to my return to hunting. The added challenge and a closer interaction with with nature was more appealing than the previous experiences I've had with hunting with a rifle. Recently I've taken up traditional archery. I went out and purchase a 66#{other brand} longbow and practiced as much as possible to feel comfortable enough to hunt with it come fall. Unfortunately the bow delaminated during one of the 3D shoots I attended. Traditional equipment is not as specifically fit to the archer as the compound and for the most part nearly anyone can shoot any traditional bow within reasonable draw weight. After my longbow delaminated, Pete offered to let me use a 51# Montana "Whip" Longbow made by Dan Toelke. Not only for the remainder of the shoot but for two weeks until the next shoot. I tried 6 or 7 of the bows Pete had with him (at all times) and took a real liking to the 51# whip. He's real lucky to have gotten it back. Now, I'm no expert and really only have my 66# longbow to compare it to but I would trade my longbow for the whip even if it weren't delaminated. The lighter draw weight was more comfortable to shoot all weekend and in between rounds. I found it very smooth and did not have to alter the way I "aim". I could carry that whip all weekend long and still be amazed a how little it weighed. A very beautifully crafted bow. I'm glad there are people as kind as Pete and Pat out there that can put these bows into the hands of us traditional green horns. It makes it much easier to decide what we like or dislike and the Montana "whip" longbow I like....a lot.

 

John Biskup

3D Director

Alberta Bowhunters Association

 
 

Review

This review will cover 2  Montana "Whip" bows, a 58" 51 @ 27"  and a 62" 45# @ 28" .You will find that the general comments apply to both bows. I will also comment on each one individualy from time to time .

The Whip is a Deflex Reflex Longbow that has a very slim profile and a small grip. Both bows have the standard Thumb rest and a locator type grip that places your hand in the same position every time you pick up the bow.The limb tips are very well done and reinforced to use any of todays modern strings.They are a well reinforced fine tip that has great eye apeal.

The Whip Bows are made with natural woods, laid up by hand .Dan does not use Dymondwood or actionwood in his bows. You have to settle for the real thing.The workmanship is flawless. Each bow is finished with Eight coats of 2 part Urethane in a satin finish.{There is no reflection at all from either of the bows.}

The satin non reflective finish is flawless, just like the workmanship in the rest of the bow.

 

The first time you pick up a Whip you notice how light and well balanced it is and how nicely it seats into your hand. There is no trying to find the right grip, it just happens.  The Whip is quiet, deathly quiet in fact. With "quiet" in any bow comes the dead in the hand feeling and these bows have it. There is no feeling to the shot, the arrow streaks away and the bow sits there. No noise, no buzz ,no shock , it just sits in your hand . This is shooting quality at its best.

The first bow to arrive was to be reviewed by Shannon Kuzik, my testing partner because I was commited to a full load of reviews.This is the 58",51# @27" whip. I was going to shoot it for a couple days just to get a feel for it and turn it over to Shannon who would take it for the summer work up a review and try to harvest an annimal with it this fall for an update to the review if he liked the bow. This plan fell apart rather quickly after I shot the whip.I took it to the range and had a few friends test shoot it and held onto it for a bit longer than planned before giving it to Shannon for his review. I just hated to let it go, and I was planing to borrow it back from Shannon to take to the shoots I go to . I always have demonstrator bows with me for people to test shoot and the Whip needed to be shot and passed around at the target butts.

When I told Dan about how much I was impressed he decided to send another bow to be taken to the events. This time we decided to pick a longer model in a light weight that everyone could shoot. The 58" 51#, @ 27" bow is a bit too much draw for the ladies and young shooters, and the short bow is not Ideal for those 30" draw shooters.It is intended for shooters with a draw of 28" or less.The second bow we decided on is  62" ,45# at 28".This one can be shot by anyone , and every shooter will be able to feel for themselves just how sweet it shoots regardless of their draw length.

Pat testing the 45# Whip

In about 3 weeks the second bow arrived and like the first one it is also flawless. I was impressed with the short 58"model and then after shooting the longer 62"bow I was sold on it. That extra limb length and light draw weight makes for one sweet shooting experience. I liked it enough that I shot it in the first 3D shoot of the season after having it for only a couple days and placed second with it.I also shot one of my best rounds ever with the Whip. It is just too easy to like these bows. Finding arrows to match these bows was easy and the setup took very little time. Forgiving is a term often debated, however I consider the whips to be forgiving. Even when I release an arrow I know I shouldn't have, it seems to find its way to the target with reasonable accuracy. The 3D 8 rings seem to be very easy to find with these bows, even on days that my mind seems to be elsewhere. This is what I call forgiving.

Frequently when I pass around a new bow to be test shot the shooters shoot a few arrows and move on to the next bow. I am finding that a lot of the guys testing the whips come back to them over and over. They seem to be a bow that the more you shoot them  the more you like them. First impressions are good , and they get better every time someone comes back to shoot them some more.

Last week at a 3D shoot a friend and the 3D director had his bow delaminate after the first round . This is his only trad bow , and he was in a bind. John had tested several bows at a previous shoot and I offered him any of the 7 bows I had with me to finish the shoot with.  The 45# whip was his choice and  is with John in Calgary now getting ready to be shot in this weekends 3D shoot. I hope it will not be to difficult to get it back from him this weekend after the shoot is over. I also hope that lending him the Whip to shoot against me  doesn't let him beat me. I do have reason to be concerned now that he has the "Whip".

The shoot John was to use the Whip at has come and gone. I had taken the 51# whip that Shanon has with me also to this shoot so that it would get some exposure too.

On Sunday John used the shorter and  heavier { 58" 51 # @ 27"} whip and I am sure he is having difficulty deciding which one he prefers . His scores went up when he shot with the 51# Whip . I would not be surprised to see John with a new Whip of his own in the near future.

 

All readings taken with a Speed Tach chronograph with 6V constant power supply at the same session .

Both bows were set up for hunting and had an endless loop 12 strand D2 string and rubber cat whisker silencers as supplied with the bows. All testing was done with a 3 under glove release.

 

 58" 51# @ 27" "WHIP" 1 PIECE CHRONO RESULTS.

  Draw length

 Draw weight

Arrow

450 

 FPS

Arrow

530 

FPS 

Arrow

660 

FPS

 

 

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  5

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  7 1/4

brace height

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  8

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  9

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  10

  7

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  11

  11

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  12

  14

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  13

  17

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  14

  19

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  15

  21

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  16

  24

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  17

  26

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  18

  28

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  19

  31

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  20

  33

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  21

  35

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  22

  37

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  23

  40

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  24

  43

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  25

  45

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  26

  48

  450

 168

  530

 154

  660

 142

 

 

  27

  51

  450

 177

  530

 163

  660

 147

 

 

  28

  54

  450

 182

  530

 172

  660

 153

 

 

 

 62" 45# "WHIP" 1 PIECE CHRONO RESULTS.

  Draw length

 Draw weight

Arrow 

450

 FPS

Arrow

530 

FPS 

Arrow

660 

FPS

 

 

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  5

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  7 1/4

brace height

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  8

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  9

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  10

  7

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  11

  11

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  12

  13

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  13

  15

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  14

  17

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  15

  20

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  16

  22

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  17

  24

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  18

  25

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  19

  27

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  20

  29

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  21

  31

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  22

  33

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  23

  35

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  24

  37

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  25

  39

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  26

  41

  450

 156

  530

 146

  660

 131

 

 

  27

  43

  450

 163

  530

 152

  660

 136

 

 

  28

  45

  450

 171

  530

 158

  660

 143

 

 

 
After shooting the Whips over the past few months I have developed a real fondness for them.
They are very light weight, deathly quiet and easy to shoot well. I do a lot of walking when I hunt and the light weight will be a nice thing after a few miles on a hot day in hill country.
They have good performance and seem to shoot heavy hunting weight arrows very well. I  can not find any issues that need to be addressed with the workmanship or design of the Whips. Dan and Jared have been excellent to work with and the delivery times on the bows is very fast. If I was to ask for any changes in the bow as received it would only be the string.
 
An endless loop string just does not have the nice look that a Flemish-twist string does. Some say endless loop strings are better, but I disagree.To me they take away from the fine workmanship in the Montana Bows. I put a 10 strand DF 97 padded loop, Flemish twist from Rod Jenkins with 2 beaver ball silencers on the 45# Whip to see how it would perform. Shooting the 450gr arow drawn to 28"{9.5GR/#} it chronographed at 176 FPS  and no gain in noise or feel with Rods string. This is a 6 FPS gain, which is not a lot, however on a light draw weight bow to be used for hunting every bit is a help.On this bow it is like gaining almost an inch of draw length. I  recomend changing the string to one like I used from Rod at Great Strings. 
There are no other changes that I would reccomend in the whip bows. They are just fine the way they are.Dan has done a very good job designing and building these Whips. They both will be used this fall in hunting season and with luck we will have some success photos to add in here with an update to the review.
 
It is easy to recomend the Montana Whip longbows to my readers. These are very well crafted and designed longbows that shoot extremely well. Dead in the hand and silent are the best features in these bows.
 
Shannon will be adding to this review with his coments on the Montana Whip bows.in the near future also.
 Here is Shannon's take on the whips.

Montana Whip

 

The first Montana Whip Pete gave me to try was the 58Ē long bow that was 51 pounds at 27Ē.  It was a Reflex Deflex long bow with all the natural woods and was very light.  It had a non-reflective finish with a thumb rest that places your hand in the correct position every time.  The craftsmanship was flawless with smooth lines.  When I took it to the range it shot very fast but quiet and had no hand shock.

 

Pete then sent me the 62Ē long whip that was 45 pounds at 28Ē.  It had the same thumb rest and Reflex Deflex limbs with bamboo core.  It was also was very light and had the non-reflective finish.  When I took it to the range it was easy to shoot, silent and dead in the hand.  My 610 grain carbon hunting arrows flew perfect with it. 

 

After shooting a bit more, I decided to use the 62Ē 45 pound whip for the 2006 hunting season.  The first hunting trip in 2006 was for elk and mule deer in the Alberta Rocky Mountains on the Jasper Park border.  The temperature was 30 degrees Celsius during the day and in the 20ís at night.  The animals stayed in the thick spruce and swamp bottoms and unfortunately the elk werenít calling so it turned out to be more of a scouting trip.

 

My second trip was again for elk but it was pouring rain all day, it even snowed for a couple hours.  I covered about 35km in the rain and mud with the bow performing flawless along the way, even though I didnít.  I missed a huge 6X6 bull elk at 12 yards!  During all the excitement and adrenalin pumping, I didnít cant the bow enough so I hit the bottom limb tip on the ground when I shot.  Unfortunately I didnít get much time to hunt last year so that was my only real chance at an elk.  You have to learn from your mistakes, I know I learn new things every time Iím in the bush hunting.

 

I did love stump shooting and hunting with the Whip Long Bow.  Its light weight was always a treat to carry on the long days chasing elk and other four legged creatures over mountains and threw the bush.  I didnít harvest any animals with the Montana Whip Long Bow in 2006 but hopefully Pete will let me borrow it for spring black bear in 2007.

 

 

SHANNON KUZIK

 

Pete Ward

"Welcome to my outdoor world."

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