PETE WARD

"WELCOME TO MY OUTDOOR WORLD"

 

Gear Review

http://www.tradtecharchery.com/

a division of

LANCASTER ARCHERY SUPPLY
2195-A Old Philadelphia Pike (Rt. 340)
Lancaster, PA 17602
1 mile East of Rte. 30 on Rt. 340

Call 1-800-829-7408 

 email  info@tradtecharchery.com

see also the

Pinnacle Review

and

My thoughts on Short risers and ILF limbs

 

Titan Recurve Bow

{See below for update with master longbow carbon Limbs}

60" 45# Carbon Extreem BF Medium  Recurve limbs

 

{Description from Trad Tech site}

· Simply the Best Quality, Most Accurate Recurve Bow Money Can Buy
· Accepts TradTech and All ILF Recurve Limbs for Ultimate Accuracy and Versatility
· CNC Machined 17” Billet 6061 T6 Aircraft Aluminum to Aerospace Tolerances
· 17” Riser Creates a 58”, 60” or 62” Bow from Short, Medium or Long ILF Carbon Limbs
· Multi–Grip Platform Accepts Dozens of Custom or Factory Grips to Allow Perfect Fit for You
· Weight, Tiller and Lateral Limb Adjustments Allow Perfect Settings for Your Custom Set–Up
· Certified Alignment, Tiller and Weight +/– 1# on Every Custom Bow Set–Up with TradTech Limbs
· Threaded Holes for Sight, Quiver, Stabilizer, Multi–Rest and Multi–Grip
· Bow Includes Top Quality Hi–Performance Flemish Twist Traditional Bowstring
· Black Anodized Non–Glare Finish and Custom Laser Etched Walnut Inlays
· Limb Options: TradTech CarbonWood ILF Limbs with Traditional Wood/Clear Glass Finish. TradTech Carbon Extreme BF Limbs with Carbon Crossweave Under Satin Clear Finish.
• Does NOT Include Plunger or Arrow Rest.

 

 

{Limb description from trad tech site}

· Extreme Engineering & Materials for the Quickest, Most Stable ILF Limb Possible at Any Price
· Custom–Made by Samick, Crafted from 2 Types of Carbon with Bakelite and Foam Dual Core
· Features ILF (International Limb Fitting) System for Use in the TradTech Titan or Any ILF Riser
· Carbon Crossweave Clear Finish, Dark Brown Limb Base
· Yellow Jacket Limb Tips are Fastflight/High Performance Bow String Compatible
· Available in 58” (Short), 60” (Medium) or 62” (Long) Lengths
· Draw Weights of 40 to 65# at 28"

Review

The Titan Metal riser recurve is a bow that I  like more every time I shoot it. I was never a metal riser fan until now. The Titan is converting me fast, however at -30 next fall I will have to re-think this.  The limbs I have for this review are medium length  Trad Tech /Samick Extreme BF . I set the tiller on the Titan to  Zero for shooting 3 under, and set the draw to be optimal at my 27" draw length.

 The Titan has the ILF limb fitting system that is used on the top Olympic style bows and some of the custom bows available today. It is a new system that most of us are not familiar with, and I like it. We don't need wrenches to install the limbs, they slip in and are secure. Draw weight is adjustable for about 4# and we can tiller the bow to our needs by simply turning the limb bolt up or down. Limb alignment is also adjustable ,and we can use limbs from any of the Manufacturers that make  ILF limbs. Trad Tech also has Carbon-Wood Recurve limbs available and Wood Glass limbs in both longbow and recurve. I am reviewing the Titan with the Extreme BF carbon limb.

Lately my shooting has been off , however I seem to have good and bad days. On the good days I shoot the Titan very well as long as my mind does not wander too far.I am finding it to be very accurate and with the target arrows it is Fast, very fast. The 16 strand TS1 endless loop string it came with is what I nornally think of as a noisy string,but on the Titan it is very quiet. I have only 1 small set of Beaver balls on it for silencing. This is all it needs for a hunting quiet bow. The typical recurve string slap is not heard like we hear on so many recurves. The Titan set up the way I have it is as quiet as most longbows are and quieter than many. It is ready to hunt without any more silencing.

This brings us to the issue of hand shock. There is absolutely no hand shock, buzz or any other hand feeling when we release the string with light or heavy arrows.

The riser is drilled and tapped for a plunger and elevated rest,however I prefer to shoot off the shelf and have a shim of Aluminium on the shelf and plate covered with velcro to let me shoot this way. Many prefer an elevated rest, but I got away from these when I started to shoot traditional bows and will not change. You have the choice to set it up the way you like.

AMO Draw length

 Draw weight

Arrow

 gr

 FPS

Arrow

 gr

FPS 

Arrow

 gr

FPS

 

 

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  5

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  7 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  8 1/4

  brace

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  9

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  10

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  11

  7.85

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  12

  11.99

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  13

  15.35

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  14

  17.99

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  15

  20.33

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  16

  22.49

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  17

  24.30

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  18

  26.32

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  19

  27.87

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  20

  29.59

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  21

  31.26

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  22

  32.98

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  23

  34.79

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  24

  36.64

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  25

  38.72

GR

FPS

 GR

FPS 

  GR

FPS 

 GR

 FPS        

26"

  40.74

  424

173

  482

165

  560

156

 

 

27"

  42.99

  424

183

   482

173

  560

164

280 

  213

28"

29"

30"

31"

  45.37

  47.89

  50.71

  55.35

  424

na

na

na

188

na

   482

na

180

na

  560

na

168

na

 688

na 

  156

na

         I expected it to be an adjustment going to a heavy riser.The extra mass weight  the Titan has did not take any adjustment from me, the bow just settles into my hand and remains stable. I don't seem to have the normal wandering before anchor I am acustomed to with those light weight bows I like so much. As spring is almost here I can not wait to take this bow to the outdoor ranges and 3D courses. I fully expect my scores to improve with it. Shooting fast arrows is not new to me, but being able to shoot very light arrows within warranty from a traditional bow is. The Titan with the Extreme BF limb can be shot as low as 5GR/Pound. I will have to settle for a 280 gr ,as my light target arrow this summer. This 6.5gr/# arrow at my normal 27"draw is traveling at 213 FPS. Distance estimation should be less of an issue at unknown distances this year. The arrows I use for hunting with the Titan will be over 600 grains . It is fun to try to see these arrows fly.

Pinnacle Left and Titan Right

For the budget minded shooter that wants to try an ILF style bow there is a review of the Trad Tech Pinnacle on this link. 

I would like to see a shelf and side plate Shim kit of some sort included with this bow for those of us that do not want to shoot off an elevated rest. Because the riser is machined I can see no reason why it can not have a radius cut into the shelf , which would make it even easier to set up the bow for off the shelf shooting. I will be trying a flemish twist 10 strand DSF97 string later on when I get one made. It should be even quieter, and quicker. It will look better, that I am sure of.

To sum up this review, I have not found any thing other than the shelf and string I would like to change. The bow is a top end shooter and it is certainly going to be sought after.For those that already have ILF limbs you can purchase the riser seperate and mount your existing limb on it for a rock solid 17" dual target and hunting bow. Trad Tech has done an excellent job designing this bow, and Samick has also done it's part right. I like it and plan to be shooting it a lot more this year,both hunting and at the ranges. It will be with me for a test drive this year at any of the 3D shoots I attend. Just say hi and ask for a turn.

Shooting the Trad Tech Titan has changed my opinion of metal riser bows. I no longer think of metal riser bows as to heavy, and loud and a bow I would not shoot. In fact I have ordered a metal riser for another bow I have since I started shooting the Titan. The metal riser Titan has won me over.

The cold on the hands part is still in question , and my love of  wood risers built by hand will never change. They are special. I do like machined metal risers now.

 

3D update 2008

I shot the Titan a lot this year, it was my 3D bow. With the Titan and the BF Extreem limbs I won all but 1 shoot in the RU class.That shoot I placed second in. The Winner of that shoot was also shooting a Titan . I did win each of the three  Alberta Bowhunters sanctioned shoots with the Titan to give me the ABA RU Class title for 2008.

 

Updated Dec 08 2008.. Trad tech Master Longbow limbs.

Catalog # 3880107

• Extreme Performance Reflex/Deflex ILF Longbow Design
• Superb Quality Workmanship & Carbon Limb Materials
• 8 Lams w/ 6 Carbon Layers with Multi-Section Maple Core
• Designed in USA, Custom-Made exclusively for TradTech by Samick of Korea
• Carbon CrossWeave on Limb Back and Belly with Clear Finish
• Narrow, Redline Phenolic Limb Tips are FF/HiPerf. Bow String Compatible
• ILF International Limb Fitting for standardized use on all ILF Risers
• Available in ILF Long(62”) Length Only (62” on 17”Titan Riser, 64”on 19” Pinnacle II)
• Draw Weight of 40-60# at 28” (on Titan or other 17” Riser)
I have had the Master Carbon longbow limbs for a couple months now and feel it is time to pass on my comments.I will start by saying I like them a lot.

 For all my shooting, including the chrono and FD curve I left the Titan adjusted as it was for the BF Extreem Recurve limbs at the maximum limb bolt setting . This works out just right for my 27" draw length.If you have a longer draw you will want to change this setting by backing out the limb bolts.We should not have to adjust the bolt settings when we change out limbs and in my case everything was just fine .

 The Master Longbow limbs that I have are medium length , and rated at 50#. They draw very smooth and I feel they have some good performance. When it comes to shooting quality when properly adjusted they are very nice. By properly adjusted I mean with the recomended brace height of 8 3/4". Below this I found them not very well behaved. When set up as recomended by Trad tech they shoot very quiet, and do not have  hand shock. On cold days hunting the high brace height is good for keeping the string off your coat sleeve.

 These are a good  looking limb that will give you some very nice shooting experiences. I did a few 3D rounds with them and liked the scores I had. I don't think I lost any accuracy with these limbs. At the practice range I had no trouble finding the arrows I liked to hunt with on them. The first choice was a 740 gr CX Rebel Runter with 400 grains of front point weight.  14.5 gr/# will certainly make a bow quiet, and it made the Titan Master LB silent with only a set of Beaver Balls on the string.  Like I disscussed above the Titan has some excelent shooting qualities and it does not lose them when you snap in the Master Longbow limbs. It does not lose any looks either. The Masters look very nice. The carbon cross weave and the slim tips give it a good look.

 I would like to see these limbs re-designed to take advantage of the performance we lose with the high brace height they require. If we could bring down the brace height to the mid 7's I know that they would be an eye opener.

 I did a bit of hunting with these limbs, but did not have any shot opportunities. Perhaps next season will be the one for the Titan.

 I commented earlier about metal risers and cold weather. It is true, metal and bare fingers don't mix. What I did to solve the problem was to use a leather grip wrap, and it worked very good. { When Rob reads this he may start offering a leather grip as an option. }Removable would be even better. Those of us that hunt in the cold would like the option of covering the front of the riser when the temperature drops below freezing. I prefer to shoot bare handed, so this is very important to me.

 

 

Master Longbow limb chart . 16 strand DF97 string endless loop. Beaver balls.

Shooting chrony with constant power supply.

All shots measuerd and coached by Pat, my wife.

AMO Draw length

 Draw weight

Arrow

 gr

 FPS

Arrow

 gr

FPS 

Arrow

 gr

FPS

 

 

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  5

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  7 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  8 

  brace 83/4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  9

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  10

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  11

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  12

  8

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  13

  12

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  14

  16

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  15

  19

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  16

  23

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  17

  25

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  18

  28

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  19

  31

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  20

  33

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  21

  36

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  22

  38

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  23

  41

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  24

  44

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  25

  46

GR

FPS

 GR

FPS 

  GR

FPS 

 GR

 FPS        

26"

  49

  452

176

  556

162

  742

146

 

 

27"*

  51

  452

184

   556

169

  742

150

 

 

28"

29

  56

  59

  452

na

194

na

   556

na

179

na

  742

na

156

na

 

 

 

Note*These limbs are set up for my 27" draw length.Longer draw lengths will back out the limb bolts acordingly to eleminate stacking. I did not have to make any adjustments for these limbs.A 10 strand DF97 flemish with padded loops will add a few FPS to these numbers.

 

Update Dec 18 /08 Trad Tech Carbon Wood Recurve limb

 45# Medium length.

  Note the CarbonWood limb is rated on a 17" Titan riser! not the 19" pinnacle riser that they also fit.I made this mistake when I first received the CarbonWood limb. The similar looking wood glass Pinnacle limb is rated for the 19" Pinnacle riser  and also performs very well on the Titan.

From the Trad tech Website

• Quick, Stable & Durable for years of accurate shooting
• 5 Lams using Clear Glass w/ Carbon & Multi-Section Hardrock Maple Core
• Designed in USA, Custom-Made exclusively for TradTech by Samick
• Beauty of Wood under Clear Glass w/ Stab
Catalog # 3880085

 

Trad Tech Titan / Carbon-Wood Trad Tech limb 45@28" /17" riser.

 Shot with a finger tab, all draws were static amd the draw length verified by Pat.

AMO Draw length

 Draw weight

Arrow

 gr

 FPS

Arrow

 gr

FPS 

Arrow

 gr

FPS

 

 

  0

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  2

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  3

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  5

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  7 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  8 

  brace 81/4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  9

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  10

  4

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  11

  10

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  12

  14

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  13

  17

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  14

  20

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  15

  23

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  16

  25

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  17

  27

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  18

  29

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  19

  31

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  20

  33

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  21

  35

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  22

  37

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  23

  39

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  24

  41

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  25

  43

GR

FPS

 GR

FPS 

  GR

FPS 

 GR

 FPS        

26"

  46

  452

168

  556

158

  742

141

 

 

27"*

  48

  452

176

   556

166

  742

147

 

 

28"

29

  51

  54

  452

na

184

na

   556

na

179

na

  742

na

155

na

 

 

 

 

Note*These limbs were set up for my 27" draw length. I did not have to adjust the limb bolts from the setting they were at for the other limbs tested above. Longer draw lengths will back out the limb bolts acordingly to eleminate stacking. A 10 strand DF97 flemish with padded loops will add a few FPS to these numbers.

The carbonwood limbs we are talking about now are a stable and good looking limb that is designed for the Titan , but with a wood veneer instead of the typical flashy ILF target finish. They are also a good option for the Pinnacle, or any other ILF bow. I am also shooting them on an ILF converted {WARF}Hoyt TD3 riser .They shoot very nice on this old riser too.

 The charts and graph show what I am trying to sumarize. The limb when set up properly, draws smooth, and shoots good. I have no trouble with noise and just use a set of Beaver Balls to silence the string.Performance is good, as the chart reflects. I will have no reservations hunting with the 45# Carbonwood limbs .

These limbs come in short, medium and long length's. There is often confusion by users wanting to get into an ILF bow on what limb to buy. The limb length's are designed to allow an archer to have the limb shoot at it's most efecient range at the varying draw length's we have. Actual draw weights will vary depending on how you set up your bow .You should be within a few pounds of the rating at your draw length after you have tuned everything. 

Those of us with a short draw will be best suited with the short or medium length limb. With these and properly adjusting the limb bolts for our draw length we will have a bow that does not stack at our draw length, and the limb will be at it's most efecient setting.Choosing to short or to long a limb will not take advantage of what the ILF has to offer.

 You can see in the chart I have these limbs set to just start to stack at 28". My normal draw is 27 to 27 1/2".

I will repeat again , the ILF system is not for buying a 45# limb and being able to crank it down to 60#. It allows us to have a stack free bow that shoots the limb at it's most efecient setting.

Trad Tech says it all in the manual that is available on line .

"Bow Length:

Your choice of bow length is a personal one, guided primarily by your draw length in order to get your best shooting performance and smooth draw that doesn’t stack increasing draw weight above 2-3# per inch.

• For archers with less than a 26.5" draw, a 58" bow (short ILF Limbs, 66"/25" riser) is recommended.

• For archers with a 26.5-29.5" draw, a 60" bow (medium ILF Limbs, 68"/25" riser) is the most popular.

• For archers with a 29-31.5" draw, a 62" bow (long ILF limbs, 70"/25" riser) is generally preferred.

Additionally, the limb bolt position modifies the ILF limb angle. The shorter your draw

length within the range of any limb length above, the more pre-load can be built into the limb

angle by shooting your bow near the top of the weight adjustment range to slightly increase

performance. At longer draw lengths within any range, shooting the bow toward the bottom half of

the weight range will minimize any stacking and provide peak overall performance and shootablity."

http://www.tradtecharchery.com/downloads/titan_user_guide_07.pdf

I strongly recomend reading the manual and understanding the ILF system and the Titan. It is not complicated at all, it is just a bit diferent, making the bow very user friendly.

For the shooter that wants to try the ILF Titan there are now some more limb options to consider.The Carbon Wood limb is a mid range limb that is stable and quick enough to make up a very good shooting bow.The limbs I have are pleasant to shoot and straight. { I have not had to make any lateral adjustments with any of the trad tech limbs I have shot.}

Please keep in mind these limbs are rated on the 17"  Titan riser, so if you are getting them for a longer or shorter riser the weight will be diferent. Ask Lee at Trad Tech if you are unsure what weight or length is best suited for your setup. These are a good limb with good looks that should meet and exceed reasonable expectations. I like them and will be shooting them along with the other limbs I have on both the Titan, Pinnacle, and some other ILF bows.

UPDATE DEC 19/08 Trad Tech Wood-Glass recurve and Longbow limbs

Click to go to the review page for these reviews.

Pete Ward

"Welcome to my outdoor world"